Nov.15 vs London

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Nov.15 vs London

Postby Overager on Tue Nov 15, 2016 11:39 pm

I realize that it was only a one goal loss but watching those two teams tonight , the Rangers are far behind the knights in size, skill and execution. We have a long way to go and forget about this story that we are much younger. We are not! We have 6 or 7 last year players(97 birthdays) and London has 3. Where are the posters on this site that last year were claiming that this would be the year the Rangers ,WENT FOR IT. Give your heads a shake. The Rangers are a middle of the league team and are having trouble rebuilding.A couple of years ago London decided that they were not going to win the league so they proceeded to trade top end talent ( McCarran , Memis and others) and ,in return ,set themselves up for a few years .Their strategy works whether we like it or not. In addition to this savy manipulation of their Roster they draft very well. Since the glory days of Peter DeBoer we have drafted and traded like hell.We don't seem to know when to throw in the towel and rebuild. And, if we go that route, I'm not sure that our hockey guys know how to handle it.We have one European who can't even crack the lineup !
Ranger fans, be realistic. Get the best we can for Bracco,Hora, Opilka /Carty,and whatever "older players we have that anyone is interested in "and build for the future. We don't need another year when we make the playoffs and then get runover by London,Erie or windsor or whoever we might face.Bracco must be worth some good young talent, if our hockey heads can recognize it. We will be sorry to see him go but we can use what he will bring in return.We are in 6th place out of 10 teams in our division,or whatever they call it.
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Re: Nov.15 vs London

Postby rgrs7 on Wed Nov 16, 2016 12:32 pm

We are in a tough spot really. I don't totally disagree with managements decision to built through the draft, but at the same time, that methodology has not translated to a premium product on the ice. We used to be neck and neck with London in terms of on ice performance and rebuilding, but the last 6-7 years have been a step back in all aspects really. I'm not a fan of trading all of our top end talent in prep for future years, but something has to be done at some point. Clearly London and Erie are at the top of the league because of their management. When will we return to the glory years? Not quite sure at this point!
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Re: Nov.15 vs London

Postby puckhead7 on Wed Nov 16, 2016 1:13 pm

Why is it that London, who made their European draft pick after us, can get Kuokkanen from Finland? Did our scouts drop the ball or was this a case that he would only report to London?
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Re: Nov.15 vs London

Postby DrummondIsGod on Wed Nov 16, 2016 1:40 pm

puckhead7 wrote:Why is it that London, who made their European draft pick after us, can get Kuokkanen from Finland? Did our scouts drop the ball or was this a case that he would only report to London?


A lot of import picks are made based on connections. London got Juolevi late in the first round last year as well. Juolevi and Kuokkanen are very close from back in Finland which must have helped London get him. Also, the Rangers guy is a year younger, so maybe they preferred a 17 year old.
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Re: Nov.15 vs London

Postby memcup on Wed Nov 16, 2016 1:45 pm

The solution is to either move to the East division or have the Knights move to another league. Lately watching the Knights ...how they are coached,how they play,how they "develop" players, how they draft and trade...they are in a league of their own.

I think the Rangers should re-watch last nights game and see what is meant by back checking. It involves a little bit more then skating back to your own zone near an opposing player.
I enjoy watching the Rangers play offence but their defensive game frustrates me.

What happened to that PK with speed & short-handed goals that we saw earlier this year? Twice last night and Friday night they had the puck and instead of continuing up ice they threw the it back toward their own end. It's great to try to waste the clock but they put the puck right back to a guy who had no time or space resulting in a made scramble to try to get the puck out again.

I'm all for trading a top end talent for a boat load of picks & /or players. Hopefully someone comes a knocking.

Regarding the import draft I've read that the draft is a forgone conclusion. Players are scouted, recruited and almost signed by the time the draft takes place.
Andersen (sp) was only available to the Rangers because the team that was prepared to take him found out he couldn't get his release and therefore changed picks at the last minute.
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Re: Nov.15 vs London

Postby kitfan on Wed Nov 16, 2016 8:35 pm

OMG the sky is falling the sky is falling quick sell the farm and everything on it. Come on Overager why would you trade all you top talent? So you can come in last and get the first pick?? What guarantee do you have if you trade all your top talent that players and draft picks that you get will get you a better team. Your solution always seems to be to trade everyone and start over. So you want a rebuilding year every year?? I have no idea why I even read anything on this board anymore everything here is all doom and gloom nothing positive and most posters that had objective comments don't post anymore. So this is my last reading here and my last post. I still don't think Overager ever played the game and will never know since he will not answer that question. Have fun with all your negativity.
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Re: Nov.15 vs London

Postby Overager on Thu Nov 17, 2016 12:38 am

kit fan- I am not preaching doom and gloom. We should have started a rebuild three years ago but management felt that we had a "chance." I don't necessarily mean giving up our top talent for draft picks because, based on our draft over the past five years it hasn't really been that good.Is Hiebert a good judge of talent? Does he have "connections" in hockey circles. Remember, his background was in education, not hockey. Has the Ranger scouting staff done a good job over the past 3-5 years. Compared to what? London, Erie? There are scouts on the Ranger team who hockey time has passed them by.Our European player can't break into the line-up of a middle of the league team! Unloding our top talent isn't such a big idea because, based on where they are at this time we don't have a lot of top end talent ready to graduate and who would be desirable by competing teams. Bracco is obviously our most desirable player who probably won't be back. Hora, would possibly get us something. Llewellyn ,Blaisdell,kohn,Henderson,Cascagnette are, realistically, not going to get a lot from contending teams. London gave up some very desirable talent to get Pu who has 30 points at this stage and at 6 ft.2 and a 1998 birthday still has a couple of years to contribute.He was Oshawa's first pick and london landed him in that trade. What did we get for Gibson, the best goalie in the league at the time. What would McInnis have gotten us at the trade deadline? With him we still didn't win a playoff game against London. Without him we still wouldn't have won a game against them but we might have picked up a valuable young player who would now be helping us. McInnis is of no use to us this year! As much as I would love to see us back with the same "status" as London I'm not counting on it.Criticize me all you want but do you have a better idea or were you one of the Ranger posters who last year thought that this was the year when the Rangers"would go for it ?"
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Re: Nov.15 vs London

Postby Overager on Mon Nov 21, 2016 2:17 pm

I guess I'm not far off the mark when I hear Farwell and some other followers also talking about what we might get in return for Bracco.It's too bad we don't have some other top end players (in their last year) who we could "auction off" to contenders.It certainly helps the rebuilding process which is where we are.
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Re: Nov.15 vs London

Postby Sideliner on Tue Nov 22, 2016 8:41 pm

I think it's a given that a Jeremy Bracco would bring in a boatload. I too agree with Mike Farwell. It is very unlikely that that this team contends this year with such a young team. It's the harsh reality. In this league you need to either be a buyer or a seller. London does this so well. Bracco IMO would be the most sought after asset out there in the league today. For instance. think of a Raddysh-DeBrincat-Bracco line in this league. The Rangers could very likely be in the driver's seat here, and not only be able to bring in picks, but possibly a good young proven prospect as well.

As far as last year is concerned, I think it was a GM's nightmare. You're sitting 2nd in the conference (if I recall correctly) at the trade deadline. So you'd be seen as insane for trading away assets while sitting near the top in the league. Yet you know quite well that Erie is the powerhouse, and you could feel London was in the early stages of hitting their stride. I think it's one of those rare cases where MH had no choice but to sit on his hands.

Anyway, this year I think the decision is much easier. The Rangers are in a similar situation to when the guy at the helm decided on the non-trade with Murphy. If its London, the decision is a no-brainer. I trust that MH has the brains to not make the same mistake as was made a number of years back.
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Re: Nov.15 vs London

Postby JEF on Tue Nov 22, 2016 9:59 pm

The Rangers are a good team. In this division you have to be a great team to get the to OHL Final. The last 3 drafts have been very good. Mascherin, Hall, Bunnaman, Meireles, Roberts, McHugh, Gareffa, Seitz, Damiani, Guest, Vallati. It's a bright future that can be even brighter with some strong additions.

We have some desirable assets that won't be here next year. I think we can trade them, give them a real good chance at making it to the Memorial Cup and still have some great hockey to watch. The young players get extra ice time and can still make the playoffs. Erie, London and Windsor need to stay ahead of each other. Getting Strome back is huge for Erie. If London goes for it, they'll need more goal scoring and Bracco is the proven choice for that. Frank Hora and Dylan DiPerna would steady any defense. Carty is the man that gives a team insurance and a great team player.

We have some great pieces that should bring some great returns. We would definitely miss these guys, we'd score less goals and win fewer games, but I still think we can make the playoffs and enjoy seeing some good entertaining hockey.
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Re: Nov.15 vs London

Postby Overager on Wed Nov 23, 2016 12:03 am

jef- There is absolutely no reason why Bracco should not be traded. The only question is how astute Hiebert is in making such a deal.However, after Bracco I'm not sure we have the quality players some think we have. The true test is what the contenders are willing to give up for any of these "older" players. Many Ranger fans see Carty as a first rate pick up. however, Carty has a save percentage around .894 and,by goal tender standards, that's not that impressive. Not shabby but not outstanding. Hora might be desirable as a steady dman. DiPerna might also appeal to some.We just have to wait and see and take the chance that some other team doesn't unload their most valuable commodity with contending teams not having much left to offer the Rangers.Timing is so very important.The trade deadline can benefit the Rangers or end up being too late.
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Re: Nov.15 vs London

Postby Sideliner on Wed Nov 23, 2016 7:27 pm

Good point about the timing. MH can't wait too long to make the deals - particularly on one involving Bracco. The "Buying" teams are going to give up their bundle of picks once. Demand will drop right after that. As the teams make their moves I think the sellers need to be ready to pull the trigger, otherwise the risk of getting a poorer return...yet on the other hand you want to get maximum return. It's a tough position that I wouldn't want to be in.

I agree with JEF. I am very optimistic about this team's future. As I mentioned too, I think we can add another good young prospect in a Bracco deal. I think a player of his caliber should demand a promising young player in return along with draft picks.

So who are the contenders? Which teams will be buyers? Erie, London are quite likely. Windsor has the luxury of loading up without concern. How about the Soo and Sarnia? Which teams have the full draft cupboards? I would consider dealing with Hamilton and Oshawa if they're interested. They're in the east. I also have an uneasy feeling about dealing with London. None of our trades ever seem to work out with them, and you know you'll be picking late in a given round on draft day if you get draft picks from them. London always finishes high in the standings.

Probably not as much demand for Carty, but a mid-round draft pick would be decent if we were able to get it.

I also agree that this team can still make the playoffs minus a few traded vets.

Just my 2 cents.
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Re: Nov.15 vs London

Postby Number65 on Fri Nov 25, 2016 9:27 pm

I think Bracco, either Opilka or Carty, and either Hora or DiPerna will be traded. The market for Bracco is likely to be the hottest.

With regard to timing, we'll need to pull the trigger before the World Juniors or wait until the deadline. I can't see Bracco being left off Team USA again, so he'll be ineligible to be traded for nearly a month.
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Re: Nov.15 vs London

Postby Overager on Fri Nov 25, 2016 11:39 pm

65- Still think this is our year "to go for it."
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Re: Nov.15 vs London

Postby Overager on Sat Nov 26, 2016 12:22 am

Bracco is our most likely player to bring us big returns. I would like to see a trade with one of the contending teams where we pick up one or two of their 2000 or 1999 players plus draft picks. McShane from Erie,Valardi from Windsor, or studnicka from Oshawa. My pick would be Valardi from Windsor. However, a lot depends on what else is coming our way. I'm leary of draft picks because we don't draft well plus the fact that a 2001 birthdate won't really help us next year since he will be only16 years old. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see London trade a top player for some up and coming hot shot. If they determine that they can't win this year they will make a move to be a seller.
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