Head hunting - really needs to end

[hitek]

Well by now I am sure everyone has seen the hit on Kennedy by Zach Kassian, if not here is the link

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B5E-aJFB3h8


Last night Bob McGowen (the fan 590) had David Branch on as head of the OHL and as the Head of the CHL to discuss
headshots, specifically Cormier's cheap shot, but also it then touched on the Kennedy hit. Here is the link if you want to listen to that interview.

http://www.fan590.com/media.jsp?content ... 93523_8960

and here is their piece on the Cormier hit/suspension.


http://www.fan590.com/more.jsp?content= ... 04246_7244

Then this morning David Branch was back on the fan on the morning show. That link is not up yet, but I heard multiple
times that it would be. Most certainly worth listening to those interviews.

On the Cormier Hit, he is leaving that up to the head of the Q to deal with, but he as much said if it was in the OHL Cormier would be done playing hockey. On the Kassian hit on Kennedy, he pretty well says that the suspension of Michael Liambas
was a warning to all players and coaches that this stuff will not be tolerated, and obviously Kassian didn't get the message.

There is a hearing this morning with Kassian, and "windsor officials", which I took to mean coach and gm, with Branch going to go over the reports, (video), listen to Kassian and Windsor and then he would pass judgement. But nothing would
be made public until after the top prospects game, so late thursday or friday the decision will be made public.


So my thoughts.. I am not going to wade to deep into the Michael Liambas hit or suspension, but that is the new "gold standard" for the OHL as far as I am concerned. Repeat offender, the incident takes place, and David Branch make
pretty hard line in the sand.. Mr Liambas, you are finished playing hockey in the OHL, good bye.

Now it may have been easy given he was a fringe player, in his overage year, to make an example. Well
have a really good look at the video of Liambas, then the Kassian hit on Kennedy. There is no question the Kassion hit
is way worse. He leaves his feet, and slow it down, frame by frame.. it is nasty nasty nasty.. Kennedy is not playing the puck, in fact he is looking up when he gets hit.

Like Liambas, Kassian is a repeat offender.. The difference here, this is a 1991 player, a first round pick by Buffalo.
If this is incident verses incident, Kassian gets a minimum of the rest of the years and the playoffs. A minimum of that, since that is what Liambas got. I personally think it is a worse hit, it for me is a clear intent to injure, and if I was
David Branch, Kassian would be done playing hockey in the OHL period.

Oh you can be sure Windor Brass, Kassian and his representative/agent, all know how bad this is, and they will
be working on pleading that they are so sorry, and he never intended to hurt anyone and on and on.

But the reality is, this is not the first time Kassian has cheap shotted someone. The difference, is he is highly touted and drafted 1991 player who is not running out of OHL eligibility.

This is where the rubber hits the road. Mr Branch, anything less than a minimum suspension of the rest of the season
and the playoffs (and the memorial cup if Windsor happens to get there again) and you have a double standard, and
I for one will be very disappointed.

We need to get head hunting, checking to the head, leaving your feet to hit some one in the head, out of the game. There is too much of it, and there is no room for it. This incident is the "poster" for what has to be removed from the game. Yes it is not an OA hitting a 16 year old rookie.. It is an 18 year old 13th overall nhl draft pick hitting an OA, nhl drafted player. But blind side, leaving your feet, elbows up like this there is just no room for.

Again I will say it, and sorry, but it really can't be said often enough.. Mr Branch, get this crap out of the game, and send the message again.. The minimum is suspend him until next september. The right thing is to Suspend him for this year, and all of next season. That will take guts and leadership Mr Branch.

But given David Branch's history of leadership, guts and making the hard decisions, I do anticipate a decision that is
at least what I described as "my minimum".

To bad, Kassian is a very talented player. But a repeat offender, saw the warning earlier this year, sure should be
fresh in his mind, made a clear choice and no unfortunately is the new poster boy for what has to end in Junior Hockey. Actually it has to end at all levels of hockey but that is another topic.

Tim Kingsbury

[StormyFan]

It's not a worse hit because Kennedy wasn't left in critical condition with a cracked skull. He has a concussion, but he will be fine.

Kassian should get 10 games at the maximum.

When I slow this down on youtube, at the point of impact, when I paused it, both of Kassian's feet are on the ice, and only get in the air after impact. Not necessarily a jump, but also not a clean hit as Kennedy never touched the puck.

This is a contact sport. Maybe the use of facemasks rather than half cages would help with these shots to the face that are causing many of these problems. Thing happen to quickly to weigh out options of the consequenses of a hit. You make the hit, then you deal with whatever happens after.

If Branch has his way, everyone will get to play with a bubble around them.

[stormfan]

Hockey will never eliminate head hunting with this response to the Cormier attack on Tam from a well known, respected hockey mind:

There was speculation that the QMJHL, which has come down hard on cases of violence this season, will suspend Cormier for the rest of the season and perhaps for the playoffs.
Devils general manager Lou Lamoriello told reporters he doubts the punishment will be that severe.
“I’m not the judge or jury, but in my opinion, no,” he said, adding he also doubted any criminal charges would be laid.

Would anyone be willing to debate that what Cormier did is just a part of the game?
Unless Lamoriello was taken out of context, it appears he would be a willing participant.

[sixandseven]

It's not a worse hit because Kennedy wasn't left in critical condition with a cracked skull. He has a concussion, but he will be fine.

Kassian should get 10 games at the maximum.

When I slow this down on youtube, at the point of impact, when I paused it, both of Kassian's feet are on the ice, and only get in the air after impact. Not necessarily a jump, but also not a clean hit as Kennedy never touched the puck.

This is a contact sport. Maybe the use of facemasks rather than half cages would help with these shots to the face that are causing many of these problems. Thing happen to quickly to weigh out options of the consequenses of a hit. You make the hit, then you deal with whatever happens after.

If Branch has his way, everyone will get to play with a bubble around them.

Kassian shows sighns of being a sociopath every time he steps on the ice. If he does not get the same or more than Liambas its because he is a !st rounder and Branch is scarred to tangle with the Sabres. As to the injury should determine penalty arguement .If you trip a player and he goes headfirst into the post and dies, should he be charged with manslaughter or just get a lifetime ban.P.S. Hey stormy fan everything you post , seems to be a direct contradiction to hitek. If he bugs you that much why dont you stop reading his posts or afront him with your constant disrespect.He not hard to find, a blind man with a cat could track him down.....

[StormyFan]

Maybe you could also assume that every time Hitek makes a post and I don't comment, I agree with him. Nothing wrong with a friendly argument in my opinion and he seems to be the only one actually saying anything worth talking about on here.

Also, yes, Branch has made it clear that the outcome indicates the suspension. That's why Liambas was done for the year. If Fanelli was never injured at all, there would have been no suspension. So if someone trips someone and they die, they yeah they should be charged with manslaughter.

[hitek]

thanks sixandseven -

So true so true.. just go into settings mark me as foe and you never see what the person writes. I have a 3 on my list.

Of course you do see their post if someone adds it to their reply.

On this incident, what is missed is the punishment never has been dependant soley on how long the other player is out.
There is some truth, if in the first incident the player gets up and is back in the game before the end of the game, there is likely no suspension. So the results of the hit, did effect the suspension length here.

In the Kassian hit, the resultant injury may be considered not as severe, however the hit was must more an intent to injure.

How the head of NHL officiating put it, and he has said it a few time on interviews, the incident is judged on its own, and not what happens after the incident. So it is the incident itself. I am all for suspensions that are judged based on
how long the other player is out, but while that creeps into the back of the minds of decision makers I am sure, that is
not how it is determined the length of the suspension.

Put another way, if all you see is the incidents or Kassian, or Cormier, or Liambas and you don't know what happens
to the players 5 minutes afterwards.. aka how bad they are hurt.. then it is easy to rank these hits and I think
anyone who knows the game will get that right.

The liambas hit may have inflicted the most damage, but would be the #3 on the list.. The other two, maybe a little
tougher to rank. Personally I think Cormier's with his elbow obviously aiming for the apponents head was #1 and Kassian's was #2, but both, without any doubt in my mind were both intents to take a player out of the game.

[hockeyvoyage]

I agree with you Hitek. Intent has to count more than injury although length of injury does matter. It is obvious tha Cormier and Kassian were intending to hurt Tam and Kennedy. Even though the resulting injuires may not be as bad as Fanelli's the intent behind the check to me makes up for that fact. It is only by God's grace or luck that Kennedy wasn't hurt worse and who knows when Tam were return. For that matter with Kennedy's record of concussions and history last year who knows for sure when he will play. Look at Booth,
Connelly and Lilja in the Nhl. Connelly and Lilja missed a year and Booth who knows. Both Cormier and Kassian should be gone for the rest for the year. They have no respect for the game or their opponent in my opinion. I doubt it will happen though.

[stormfan]

Maybe you could also assume that every time Hitek makes a post and I don't comment, I agree with him. Nothing wrong with a friendly argument in my opinion and he seems to be the only one actually saying anything worth talking about on here.

[hitek]

stormfan

Too funny.. I am still keeping him on my foe list.. although if I was the only person saying anything worth talking about, I wouldn't bother reading the forum. Without question my biggest disappointment on the forum (besides drawing fire on players) is not hearing more from some of my favourite writers. But I love reading the forum. Stormtrackerguy, does the best job of any poster on any forum, period. There are lots of outstanding stuff on here. In fact, to be honest, a couple of years ago when I went from a sandy-bagger to a poster it was because I feared this forum was not very active. Right now,
this forum doesn't need me. I could easily go back into posting retirement. In fact have thought about it
a lot.


So thanks for the lefthanded compliment, but if you really agree with everything I post that you don't comment on, that is likely scary. Mind you, who knows, I don't see your posts so maybe you hammer me on most everything I say. I would say though, read a lot closer to what others are posting. There are lots of good discussions. There really are.

But hey, I am not a stormy fan.. Would much rather toss Stormy over the boards on teddy bear toss night, and be done with
the over-sized mascot. Spyke Rules !!

Tim
ps: and when the mascot makes me look like I have an eating disorder, you know the mascot is too big !! lol sorry.. had to beat a bunch of you to that punch..

[hitek]

Well well, to say I was disappointed in David Branch would be an understatement, and I don't say that
very often. As the commissioner of the OHL and President of the CHL he has done an awesome job over
a long period of time.

In this case though, he blew it and it was not as if he was not warned. By that I mean when he handed down
what really is a lifetime ban, but was the rest of the season, and all of the playoffs for a player earlier this
year, multiple people made the point. Wow, that is awesome, but exactly what will you do if it is ever a start
player. If you don't hold the line and give the same thing, you will be opening yourself up.

In fact, and you can ask him, I used the Barrie Colts and the Windsor Spitfires as my example. No not this
player, I wasn't quite that good. I said, what would you do if Hall for example, gets a couple of suspensions
then blind signs a guy and it is an obvious very bad penalty.

So it wasn't Hall, nor did I expect it ever was... But it was the 13th overall NHL pick, a 3 time suspended player
that he was passing judgment on.

20 games. If we removed the suspension earlier this year, I could live with 20 games. But the bar was
set. The rest of the season and all of the playoffs.

Of course, with this, the Spitfires gave up a huge amount for the kid, and are trying to repeat as the Memorial
Cup Champions. If this was some lesser known player on, hey the Guelph Storm what would have the sentence have been.
It sure would not have been 20 games.

What happened was Windsor knew this was a huge problem, this kid should be gone. I am told, they put together
their own video pack, with the best angle to show that it really wasn't that bad. They got his agent, who happens to
be Bobby Orr involved. Oh I am sure a day or so later the CHL's showcase Top Prospects Game where Bobby Orr
is a big part had nothing to do with anything. Yah right.

Last night on 590 the fan Bob McGowen interviewed David Branch.

here is the link to the interview:

Without question, the worst explanation David Branch has ever given, when you will hear him suggest who
the coaches in Windsor are going to counsel him, and they thought it was ok for him to come back.

You must be kidding David, look what they gave up and do you think we are stupid. You take this
kid out of their lineup and they think, forget what anyone else thinks, but they think they are a much
weaker team. The windsor spitfires would have said anything and done anything to get the kid back.

Come on, don't insult our intelligence.

I am sure that was not how David Branch intended it, but that is how it came across.

And David, I have the video of the game, as sold via the official ohl channel. Not a pick and choose what
feed, the actual game film that I bought and paid for. Maybe I just have better technology than the OHL has.
If so, I would be happy to share. I slowed it down, 1 frame at a time. "He didn't leave his feet" and "he didn't hit.... (kennedy) in the head".. Both can be heard in the Branch interview.

My response, you sir are incorrect. The video does not bare your explanation out.

Although I would say this, even if it had, this was way more vicious, way more an intent to injure than the hit
that prior resulted in a lifetime ban. That is not just my opinion, Many of the best hockey mind involved in
sports broadcast today have made the same point. In fact, where a discussion of the two hits comes up, I am
yet to hear any expert say differently.

In fact I am also told that question of was it worse was not allowed as a condition to the interview with David Branch. I am not sure how true that is, it is a rumor I have heard. But it certainly made sense given Bob McGowen didn't ask, yet
compared the two dozens of times over the last while on his show.


But here is the link of the Interview with David Branch explaining the decision

http://www.fan590.com/media.jsp?content ... 90641_6868


To add another view point, after the 20 games were announced, but before the Branch interview,
an OHL and NHL owner was interviewed on the fan. Here is that interview

Interview with Eugene Melnyk 30 minutes before David Branch
http://www.fan590.com/media.jsp?content ... 173803_436

Now you could say, ok Eugene he is a 1st round Buffalo pick and not a Senator pick, but listen to his interview
and then Branch's again. I think he was pretty genuine !! His view, the kid should be gone, period, for the rest of his career..

So look, it all comes down to where the bar is. Branch put the bar high, and made an example of a player who in the
Grand scheme of things was going no where, and was expendable to the OHL.
Now, with this decision it is clear. There are two classes of citizens in the OHL.

Older or expendable players who are repeat offenders and who you can make an example of, and star players
or players who are really valuable to a potential championship team, and even when they are repeat offenders,
you have to make it look like your tossing the book at them, but really your just throwing an underhand toss.

20 games, if this suspension has come down this time last year, I would have said, yah... would have liked more, but ok..
I can live with that. This year, after Branch suspends a player for the rest of the entire season (obviously more games) and the playoffs.. this suspension is outrageous.

Here is my next warning David Branch... you will have lots of folks in Windsor happy happy happy.. a star player
gets to join them for a game or two and the playoffs.. But the rest of the Junior Hockey Community... I think,
you are in for a very big surprise. Get ready for the biggest negative onslaught you have had in your OHL career !

I really believe this is about to get a life of its own, and hey... you set the bar earlier this year..

Get ready to live with the consequences of not meeting your own bar !


Tim

[stormfan]

To comment on your post in its entirety I think you have some good points and some that I personally disagree with. Matters of opinion more than anything. For instance I would be disappointed if the Storm didn’t do everything they could to lighten the potential for a season ending suspension if it was a Storm player facing the music. One thing I am sure of is if David Branch reads this forum, the next time you personally talk to him you might be in for a very big surprise.

One point you make has me scratching my head from a purely logical perspective:

And David, I have the video of the game, as sold via the official ohl channel. Not a pick and choose what
feed, the actual game film that I bought and paid for. Maybe I just have better technology than the OHL has.
If so, I would be happy to share.

How can you have better technology than the OHL when you bought the footage from the OHL?

[Rangers_Fan_All-the-way]

He was going for a body check and landed it. His feet did not leave until after the impact and it was not up against the boards where the guys head can bounce off. I really don't see how this come close to being as bad as the Liambus hit let alone being worse. I am one who agrees that the injury should help with the suspension if the intent is there....but that is so hard to judge. How can you say that Kassian intended to give the guy a concussion anymore than the guy who runs over the kid coming across the ice with his head down and is 'legally' hit. Both kids end up with a serious injury but one touched the puck first.....that is a real fine line.

20 games is a perfect suspension. You went over the line but Kennedy will be back and hockey will move on and learn....although some kids may not.

[hitek]

As I expected, gone for the rest of the year and playoffs.

http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/nhl/news?slu ... &type=lgns

[Nanker Phelge]

rangers fan all the way, stormyfan,
how you 2 see anything other than Kassian trying to maim him is beyond me.Because Matt was looking up at the puck doesn't punch Kassians ticket to rip his head off.
it has everything to do with repecting the other player when he is in that position.Watch any game ,95 % of these kids are smart enough not to react this way in that situation.
This guy and the Cormiers of junior hockey have to be dealt with harshly and with the same meaness as their acts.

[hitek]

Stormfan said "How can you have better technology than the OHL when you bought the footage from the OHL?"

My reply.. My comment was somewhat tounge in cheek.. If you listen to Branch he says from looking at the video (the inference for me is that was part of Windsors presentation) that they did not see him leave his feet or hit Kennedy in the head.

So your point is mine exactly.. I have no clue (actually I do but it is not relevant) where Windsor got or what the video they were using, you need to go no further than the video for sale via the OHL agreement. Now if I can slow it down
to frame by frame and see both he has left his feet and he makes contact with Kennedy's head.. One of three things are
the answer:

1) David Branch is lieing... I doubt it.
2) He has not seen this video...... again I doubt it
3) They do not pocess software or a way of slowing the video down to a frame by frame view to isolate it...

This surprises me, but I have no other explaination.